Diary Entry 254. "A Mid-West Goodbye" (3:3 with Ken Madden)

[00:00:00] echo go go go go go go go go go go go. Hello diary listeners and I'm sure uh consummate Ken Madden fans at this point we are back with our third installment or diary entry with Ken and I'm calling this third piece of our time a Midwest goodbye and if you know anything about Midwesterners you know why enjoy listeners.

[00:00:30] Welcome to the Apprenticeship Diaries where raw meets refined. Let's be real we're still working on refined. What it took, what it takes and the stories that are made. Join us as we learn from professionals about how their stories begin.

[00:00:50] Echo go go. It's just you know it's just so cool. Art's the same way. It's like a Vermeer painting. Have you ever seen them up close? Yes. It's just like a dot that does everything. Everything. It's like how? Eyeballs. So you and I just talked about eyeballs. You can do I've done I've seen this so many times of people I know I'm not a life draw but I can do eyes very well. And people like oh just I just can't get the eyes right. I come over with a.

[00:01:17] With a with a white out from a paper and I just go watch. Dunk dunk dunk and they're like oh I'm like you had everything right except for there's a highlight because there's a glisten. There's a glisten. We always call them farkles. It has a farkle and in cars. And you know what's great about the white out?

[00:01:39] It it offers because it has that a little extra presence you know like it's not flat. It has like substance to it. It's 3d. It picks up light and yes it creates that little bit of dark underneath of it that is always surrounding the highlight. So it it creates that illusion. It instantly.

[00:02:01] In the world of what I do in the automotive art world. I mean those little dots of light are everywhere because everything's shiny and everything has curves and points and edges and in bounced light and yeah. And you know the more the merrier you know and in how you put them in there. You know if you have a row of say you have a row of metal things that are all shiny and the lights coming in here. You're gonna have a row of little dots of shine right. And you can have it just straight gray.

[00:02:29] You put one dot in each one like that and all of a sudden it looks like shiny metal. I'm like you don't have to do everything. No no it's very easy actually. Trickery. Yeah it's trickery. It's great. Well and it's God. God's like it's incredible because you know all of what we're talking about is how light hits matter and you did that picture of the prism.

[00:02:56] And again prism when light filters through a prism you get a rainbow. That was a promise of not destroying us at least by water again. Maybe that's why you want water and everything. You know the fire is coming. It's coming. I want water everywhere. Surrounded by it. I'm just gonna be surrounded by water. To make sure. But just in case I'm also building an ark.

[00:03:26] There you go. Are you? Yeah well because you know you can be surrounded by water to a point and then you need a place to go because the water's completely surrounded you. True. But he said he said it was not going to destroy us by water again. So. That's true. Yeah. Only fire now. Yeah there'll be fire now. It's true. But if I can if I'm on the water in an ark it probably won't. Well unless it's made out of fire. Shoot. You'll be raptured away man. I might have misthought this. You'll probably just be sucked up. Just be like.

[00:03:55] It's pretty arched off subject but I want to go visit that ark they built. My parents did. I got to go see that. That looks really cool. They thought it was amazing. It was a little fettered because they ended up getting an airbnb that had really bad mold and my mom got really sick afterwards. So yeah. But they've said it was incredible. Yeah I want to see that. It's only eight or nine hours from me so I should. Yeah check it out. That'd be fun. That'd be a good place.

[00:04:22] That's a good place to stop on the way out to see you so you can do like tattoos on Stacy that she wants. Well and you know we have in DC we have the the Bible Museum like that. Yeah that's right. So you could make it a full you know biblical journey mission. And with Doge there'll be plenty of cheap places to stay because it won't be even DC working anymore. There you go. I mean I'm only 45 minutes away.

[00:04:48] It's a very easy like I could just put you on the train and you could go right in and then just navigate all DC. Oh that'd be fun. Yeah. Yeah it's fun. I like that idea. I like that idea a lot. Yeah dude. Hopefully you'll get out here one of these days too. Oh I know. I um. I gotta find a tattoo place that needs you to come out. Nobody needs me. I mean they don't.

[00:05:17] There's a couple that I know of that need you. They don't need me. I assure you. I'm sure I'm fairly certain the tattoo shop that I worked at when I was there. There does not like me nor want me there anymore. Um I run it. I'm. Uh we ideologically. Nope. You guys are opposites. Tattoo shops in Minnesota. Minnesota do not think like you. No. No.

[00:05:43] Um which is fine because um I don't you know everybody's got to have their hustle right. Exactly. Well and if you're if you're doing tattoos and you're in that area um that's that's what you're doing. Yeah I I really just I really disconnected with Minnesota in in general just simply because

[00:06:08] I don't know I I really got upset when they decided to teach tattooing in um the the federal like the prison. Yeah yeah. I was upset about that. I was upset about a lot of things so I left. I literally left Minnesota. Well you're in Wisconsin so. Yeah. So maybe maybe Wisconsin is Wisconsin different as far as like.

[00:06:33] Yeah there's there's like any of the midwestern states wherever the tallest buildings are at the crazier the the ideology of weirdness is. Yeah if you find a cute like. But there's where we're at there's there's a town in Richmond that's got a couple of great shops one of them one of them did the anime tattoo on Tucker my son's arm that came out just phenomenal. I was kind of. It doesn't have to be a great shop.

[00:07:03] It just has to be a shop that'll offer me a chair. All right. If it has a good feel like I. You want a vibe. I would like yeah I would like a shop that when you walk in it's the same as when you walked into your church. Yep. Like do they have time for you? Will they talk to you? Are they considerate you know like if you get a good vibe that's. Sure. That's that's my thing. That's what I find about that you know.

[00:07:29] I walk in a tattoo like I go to them I don't have any tattoos and for no other reason than I just don't have any tattoos. I'm not for it against it or anything. You and I have had the talk. I'm like yeah. Part of me is I'm an artist. There's only a few people I trust to do what I would want. You got cool shirts. So I got cool shirts and motorcycles. That's what I do. But right. I go into some of these shops with Stacy you know and first of all we're walking in there. Money's not a problem. Paying for the tattoo is not a problem. So that's out the window.

[00:07:57] We're older and I'm you know so we're not just some kid walking in. Right. They don't obviously they obviously don't know what I do for a living or that I'm have any talent at all. So there's always that. Condescension. There's always the condescension that starts that. I'm the same exact way so I can't get mad at them. But when someone says you know oh I'm an artist I'm like sure you are. You know. Sure you are. I've been I've been literally an artist for 40 years.

[00:08:28] Yeah. I'm an artist. You know. Are you an artist? What do you do? And nine times out of ten they're not. Yeah. But when you go to the tattoo shop most of them are artists. You know. And the ones we're going to we're going to some pretty good ones. And there's some talented MFers out there man. Oh. There's just there's no talented people. Isn't it great? I love that. Me too. I love it. But again there's that vibe of like it's like a Harley Davidson dealership. It's the same way.

[00:08:56] You walk into a good Harley Davidson dealership. It's like I work at Harley man. Fucking America rock on. Piss on jet bikes. You know that's not a good Harley shop. A good Harley shop walks in and they they're into motorcycles. Yes. You know and the tattoo people are into the art and you can feel the difference. And in some places I'm like she's like well I'm gonna I'm like I wouldn't go back to them. Yeah. They didn't give a shit about what you wanted. You know you can tell when someone's got a passion for it.

[00:09:25] And you said this. I remember you said it to Logan. You said it to Tucker. Both my kids. Yeah too but it has to be a it has to be a good fit. We need to be able to jive. Yeah. You know I'm not just gonna do it for money. There's times where you have to. And there's times you're starving and you need to. And that's the worst thing in the world. I hate just doing something for money. Yes. You know I just did.

[00:09:54] In those kind of in those kind of situations you try to do something that's pretty basic. You know you can. Yeah. You can do little things that most anybody can do. And that's how you make your money. You just do a lot of them a day. Right. And you just you know turn it out. But then you have opportunities to do something that really you didn't want to do. But the the opportunity was so meaningful you just had to. You're compelled. And I just did one last week.

[00:10:21] I got a call last Monday for a friend of mine that has an automotive shop that I do a bunch. I do pinstriping and airbrushing for him when he calls because it's always something cool. Like I don't do that stuff anymore but he's like yeah I got this 34 Ford and I put flames on it. We need to like drop a shadow under there and pinstripe. I'll be right up man. Yes sir. Quarter million dollar car. I'm down for that. Yes. He calls me up and he goes oh a friend of mine just died and his son was looking for someone to

[00:10:49] to do some he was he was a motorcycle guy and a car guy and they found your business cards in his in his in his car. He was gonna he was looking for someone to do some pinstriping on his bike. Oh man. And I'm like okay what what do you need? He goes this is really hard like I said it's Monday. Yeah. He's like Saturday is the the the wake or whatever the funeral. Would you be able to they're getting the urn like on Wednesday night?

[00:11:19] Is there any way I'm like I the guy was like an hour and a half away from here. I'm like if he can bring it here I can do it. I don't have that I wish I could but I just I don't have the time to spend there. I can't do it. I got other things. He's like well let me see. So anyway the guy gave me a call Wednesday that the the son of the dad that died. The son's probably 35 years old. Dad was like 68. Wasn't that old? And he's like here's the deal. So he brought you I'm like if you can be here tomorrow.

[00:11:49] Tomorrow night I can we can lay it all out. You can sit here right with me. We'll do it right there. We'll come up with something cool. It's gonna take a few hours to dry so you can take it home but just. Don't touch it. Don't touch it. It's one shot sign painters enamel. Yeah. And so he came in and I'm laying it out and putting his name on there. He wanted like hot rod style flames or not flames but pinstripes you know like the old school like the flask I gave you guys. Yeah. So I love doing that stuff. I used it by the way. Oh good.

[00:12:18] You came with me to the last Paradise tattoo gathering. Chick ass. Yeah man we were I'm sorry to segue this beautiful story but you did come with us and we were cool as shit because we had really good whiskey in there and it was cold and we were in the mountains and we just kept walking up to people to do really like whiskey and they were like oh yes. I love it.

[00:12:47] Oh that's great. So you made it extra awesome. It was it was the same kind of thing you know so I put the you know I had I had done a job like a year ago doing some lettering so I finally bought a set of nice lettering quills to actually do lettering. Oh very cool. Well I mean they differentiate me so so I was able to write his name on it and then he showed me a picture of a truck that him and his dad built like back in 20 years ago and it was like a big

[00:13:13] like monster truck kind of thing like purple with the you know the classic flames that went from yellow to orange to red. Yeah. And I'm like let's use all of the colors from that truck on this urn. So I'm paying it all on there and stuff like that and I'm getting it on there and I'm like you know I'm like so this is this is coming along good. I said I said you know when they put your dad in here have him be careful. He's like oh dad's in there. Oh I love it. I'm like well that's why it's so heavy.

[00:13:42] That's you being a tattoo artist. Yeah in a way. In your way. It's just one of those things it's like. Oh what a beautiful thing. I went and I he's like what do I owe you? I'm like you don't owe me anything. I you just this is. I don't. Too cool. If you want whatever you feel like but you don't owe me anything. This is just you know I'm you're a friend of Ron's and stuff like that. He's like you know he left he gave me 150 bucks anyway which is more than I would have

[00:14:11] even charged but he's like he's like we had a nice talk you know I'm just sitting there talking about I mean the guy's dad died you know five days before and you know he was bummed but he wasn't distraught. You get past that. Yeah. Yeah. A couple days and so he was just telling stories about the dad and what they did and show me pictures and I'm like well how about this how about that and like we're. We're writing the dates around like do you want me the dates to be you want like 19 this

[00:14:41] and that or 20 this or just do the you know. You were a chat to artists for a day right there. The last two digits. Yeah same kind of thing. That is exactly what we do. We're sitting there we're chatting we're telling stories you know we're asking. He's like yeah for the year just to keep it so it's not so busy maybe we just make it maybe make it just the two numbers on the back and not like 1962. You know I'm like all right so I laid it all out and I looked at him like you know what I think you're gonna change this because if you look at the numbers it says 666.

[00:15:10] Oh no. If we don't put the the dates here because it was like 1966 was when he was born and then you know six was the day that he. Oh my god. And you're like no. I'm like why don't we just wipe that off and put the. He's like that's probably a good idea. He goes I wouldn't care. I'm like yeah but there's some I mean you're gonna have an aunt or something that's that's a Christian that's gonna good point.

[00:15:33] You were I mean that is exactly what you know it was kind of like a moving consultation meets a tattoo appointment like if you know you can wipe the tattoo off and start over again but you were basically you know his dad was in there. He was right there. That's awesome. I love that story. That's so cool. After that Saturday the next Monday I got a bunch of well that Saturday after the wake

[00:16:00] or after the funeral he he messaged me and he's like everyone loved that. That was really really and I'm like you know this is I like being able to do that stuff and I've done more than once. I mean I flamed a whole coffin for a friend of mine's dad that when he died they're like can you bring in can you. That's what I thought I was getting at was not an urn but a coffin pinstripe coffin. I did the whole thing top to bottom front to back we spent like six to seven hours on

[00:16:24] it just wow and striping it and and then they uh when they buried their dad they made him switch out the tops. They said you can't listen so it's hanging in their garage now. Oh that's awesome. So they have it. That's cool. Yeah I did that and I did some of the invitations for for another guy where I did some drawings of him riding his motorcycle kind of a cartoon you know kind of thing and uh

[00:16:51] it's just that's the kind of stuff as an artist you're like this actually means something. And you know you try to do it as best you can it's always a super rush because it just is. You can't know when someone's gonna die. Yeah. That that's where having honed your skill means the world because right then in that moment it means more to that person than anything you've ever done. Anything. Yeah. Yeah. You know.

[00:17:20] And he's down here because you know you've been in this room. There's there's nowhere you can look in this room there isn't shit to look at. I mean it's just. I'm telling you. That's awesome. Awesome. So he was having he's down here for 20 minutes. We're talking about what he wants to do and stuff like that and then he sat down he's just like holy cow this is pretty neat. Yeah you want a drink? I'll make you drink real quick. Yeah I told him I said you want something to drink?

[00:17:48] I got I got uh we got highfalutin lowfalutin but he drove three and a half hours to get here. Yeah. And then he turned around drove three and a half hours home and it was snowing. Aw. You know and it was at night I mean I work during the day so it's seven o'clock at night. Wow. And so it was. God bless you man that's awesome. It was just to be able to do it was really cool and it just you know I thanked God that night. I said thank you for you know putting this skill in me. Yes.

[00:18:18] To make someone that I don't even know that'll never see me again show be able to show this and there's no when I do that stuff there's no signing it there's no business cards there's no nothing I just go you know how to get a hold of me if you need anything. Yeah. I don't this isn't commercial this is. Well you already had your business card. Well it's true. His dad did anyway.

[00:18:44] No I know 100% it's just kind of like no I was a part of something too special that it was like it's just it was meant to be. Those moments are precious. Yeah. They're precious to me I really like that so. Unfortunately with me like with with tattooing I always make a year of grieving before I reflect on it in a tattoo form. Yeah.

[00:19:10] Um just because it can be very emotionally driven and you can mark that pain on yourself too and sometimes people break down and you know really start crying and like it it's way too like acute and when you're I mean it's like torture when you're tattooing somebody so

[00:19:33] like you know like it's a little bit you know and if if if it isn't like if it isn't like a reconnection to something that was lost you're too much in the emotional state of it you just brand yourself with the emotion and it stays and that energy stays for forever and it I can see that it's pretty intense so it's nice when people can do something like that that can bring joy to

[00:19:59] the entire you know wake or celebration of life and it can be something that's very personal for that moment that can give everybody in that room some kind of I've done it once with a tattoo and it was for my aunt and it was with my cousins and she had a phrase whatever because she died of COPD and my cousins they were like how you doing mom and she would just be like it is what it is yeah

[00:20:29] yeah my cousin Jenny is really good letter at lettering and so she had written it is what it is and they all got it is what it is oh how great on them yeah right after their mom died and it was like the day after she passed we like I got them all in there and we all did it well I didn't do it but

[00:20:51] I did it for them and um you have one of my paintings that when my dad was dying it was this is what held me together I did inktober that year yes in paintings that match it's beautiful you get the match and I love that match it was I sat right down here at this desk and I told myself I'm not I'm gonna do this like I did the church things I'm not having any preconceptions I'm not looking at the word

[00:21:19] and also I'm not drawing anything out with a pencil first I'm gonna do this all just completely by the heart because I am tore to pieces my dad was in a mess yeah and he died on the October 19th that year so it was really and so I had at the end of that month I had 31 paintings you know and you know now what am I doing with them and it's just like I didn't want to just get rid of them but people

[00:21:49] that I cared about you being one of them reached out and said oh I really like that one I can I have that one or could we buy this one can we do that yeah I was like wow I like my kids liked a couple of them and they don't like anything I do I don't know maybe they appreciate it maybe they're like me and my dad I would try you got scans of them all right or pictures yeah I've got yeah I've got them

[00:22:11] all because I think it would be a really cool thing if you made a book out of them and that would be cool and talked about your dad in there and like you know uh just you know the actual thing and like make make a book that people could look through and they could see all the different things and just you know what what the prompt was but then also what was happening in the background right and it would

[00:22:39] be a really cool you know kind of like I don't know like a a how to manage grief and loss and all of that it'd be a really cool that's a good idea thing if you need a scan I have a scanner and I have it so I can always get you a really good I think I I'm pretty sure I got a picture of that one I think I took a picture of all of them okay um but uh because I try to photograph everything I do

[00:23:03] yeah I've got I've got a nice setup for that too but it was interesting like when my after my dad passed he was you know he's got he wrote music for since 1947 he's been writing and playing music you know incredible and um I got an old cassette tape that I found I forgot I even had from 1982 Fairbanks Summer Arts Festival in Fairbanks Alaska where he brought Chris Calloway up and a bunch of

[00:23:32] the best musicians from Boston and Chris Calloway is Cab Calloway's daughter and at the time she was uh she was a star on The Doctors which was a set of a soap opera during the day oh right on but she was a singer like unbelievably good jazz singer and I found this cassette and I'm like oh it's the cassette I listened to all the time when I was younger I mean I was I was up there the next year I wasn't

[00:23:56] up there for this one but you know through technology I just said well I want to convert this before the cassette just stops working because it's all you know the paper it's all wrinkled it's all yellowed and um so for like 40 dollars I bought it Amazon it looks like the old tape recorders like you know but it you play the tape and it it converts it did to a digital format you have an mp3 so then I put that on my soundcloud now now I can use that for all I've used it a whole bunch of

[00:24:24] times for different background music and things that I've done how cool with my dad and so that's a whole other side business you could do too for people because if they have a consent of their parent you can convert that into an mp3 and there's there's all these musicians that are you know dying and these guys are you know they he he conducted the they did rehearsals every Monday morning from 10 10 in the

[00:24:51] morning till 12 in Phoenix Arizona at the union hall the musicians union hall which is an old bank I mean this is so it's so sketchy and there was so the 18 guys would get together and they do they do uh they'd rehearse right but they never had any jobs they didn't have gigs they just rehearsed and they'd play like charity things or what some events of something pop up but so I went and and the this was

[00:25:20] before he he wasn't doing great but he was still up and around and be able to drive and walk um we had a blood problem blood disease but he uh he's like you want to come to this this uh rehearsal with me and instantly I turned into the 11 year old me like no no I don't want to go to that these are the most boring things in the world and Stacy looked at me and she goes your dad wants you to go with that you're crazy for not going and I'm like all right dad let's go boy am I glad I did

[00:25:50] so I brought all my recording equipment and video cameras and mics and everything and record it these guys were all like top musicians like crazy like studio guys toured with everybody you'd ever heard of that was a big band a lot of them were in their 70s and 80s still just playing and in my dad's conducting he was he was doing the conducting and arranging and uh like he does this one thing the guy

[00:26:16] was playing a baritone sax this is baritone sax solo and he's like you could get through with the song goes let's do that again Jimmy this time you're gonna stand up stand you do a lot better job stand up the guy's 87 years old he's like all right so he played it and I recorded the whole thing I'm like this is gonna be great and he gets up there and he plays it he wrote the old man was right dad played it better when he was standing up so I put that it's on my youtube page there's a whole there's a whole tribute section to my dad on the youtube page with a bunch of music he did

[00:26:45] and at his funeral we did his funeral it was uh Halloween day in 2022 down in in Fountain Hills Arizona and we did it it was a Monday we we had to do it between 10 and 12 so that all that band instead of rehearsing they all came over and played a concert and that was his funeral oh I love it it wasn't this big sad awful thing no it was wonderful my brother gave your dad is yeah my brother gave a little

[00:27:15] speech and another gentleman that was good friend of my dad's gave a speech and then they played six songs it was like a little concert it was awesome I mean that's what creativity does you know what was also um you know we're speaking about this and and this is kind of like our interaction with God and our gifts and things like that so you're bringing this up and um just today one of my I've I've been

[00:27:42] contacted now because I've done a podcast now for a few years so I have a little bit of not a little bit of knowledge more than the average person pretty damn good podcast oh it's it's are we gonna do one today I've been recording this whole thing are you kidding that's great you know it's a comic I I'll probably put it on YouTube too I'll edit it a little bit better as a quick aside for the listeners of Amy Nichols and these apprenticeship diaries out here we never know when it starts or

[00:28:12] stops you just it's on and Amy and me are like we'll see each other well once and then there's no such thing as a short conversation no whether it's text message or it doesn't matter whatever if Joe Rogan if Joe Rogan would have you and me on it would be 17 hours we'd break records anyway he's my fangirl

[00:28:41] like he's great I would uh but anyway um one of like one of my favorite people at church uh his name it's Dick and Donna they're they've been married for like 60 some years and um they're incredible and they're so amazing I love them so much and um Dick was telling me how his son is starting oh he wants

[00:29:07] to start a podcast um but and and he wants to do a podcast about um talks around death you know like and and how you want to die how you want to prepare for death you know uh and confront that but it's funny that we're kind of touching that topic and I was talking with Dick about it and I said I please let me know when your son releases his podcast I don't know the the name of it or

[00:29:36] anything yet but I plan on shouting it out when it happens and I said I know the answer to all of those questions for myself if I get you know like you know there's pending a lot of variables but I'm very comfortable with that that conversation I think it is a conversation people will listen to um but I I I think you should probably um really interview with him too I'd love to put you in

[00:30:02] touch with him like that'd be great yeah the um Carol's another one too since she's had to yeah she's incredible she would be great yes the the the loss of my dad was it's it's really interesting what happens to you you know it it's uh it's it's strange what goes on in you in your mind when you and you know some people had bad relationships and things like that I I didn't I had a good

[00:30:31] relationship with my dad and um we had we had the best last last conversation that I could ever imagine I have zero regrets there's nothing I was like god I wish I would if I had another none of that it was it was like unbelievable but after after he had died the the the stuff that triggers you and the things that just hit you and even this is now it's a few years later once in a

[00:30:56] while someone just out of nowhere just hit you you're like whoa yeah I feel bad again now why why why is this you know what what's you know how do you how do you work with that and you know it was while he was ill before he died you know I I had to be kind of the strong one

[00:31:19] and my sister was taking care of him and she was just totally overwhelmed with him and with it and it made it really difficult so all of us did we there was infighting and there was I ended up leaving and coming home early yeah when I was down there to help him and uh god I just remember that there was a dark feeling of guilt with that too that the rest of the family said no you're not to

[00:31:49] feel guilty about that we understand what's going everyone they were all like and I was like oh this is wow this is I mean there was some really dark times that turned into really bright times because people were like don't worry about it's not it's not a big deal it's you you do what you had to do and but still what do you there's those times like I'll call my mom still and I this is something I really thank her for is she'd never changed the answering message on the phone oh it's his voice

[00:32:18] yeah awkward old guy trying to make a you know recording you have reached so it's so into this house if please leave a message and we will get back to you as soon as we can thank you you know it's but it's my dad and it's his voice and you know I I've got I've got his one of his

[00:32:42] trombones I've got his keyboard that he played on I've got some of his music that he wrote and you know you I I don't play trombone I know how to I I just don't right but like you know so when I had my granddaughter over and she gets in the she she comes over now she's you know three and a half so she talks and she goes she comes over papa can I play the instruments let's go down to where the instruments are because I have a whole room with drums but now I have a bass I got all this stuff

[00:33:13] I got the trombone and I start playing the trombone and she's like that is too loud she's just had nothing of it I could I can hear my dad laughing I mean I could just you know I'm playing this is the mouthpiece he played through this is the this is this thing that he made this music I used to carry when I was a little kid to the thing so it's yeah loss can be horrible

[00:33:36] if you look at it as horrible but you can also look at what's left and and and what what you can gain from that in your own life and spread to other people I mean when you have God it I feel like there's more of what you have left because you you know nothing's been lost really you know like it there's something waiting for you and there's something still buried there and there's a lot

[00:34:05] for you to give to the family within that so right everything I think of is it like I I have to I have to rise to the occasion of my life and now I have to carry a mantle there's like now a a thing I ha it's kind of like what you said I I'm I'm trying to make a painting my dad would be proud of like but now it's with your whole family it's it's with everything that you do it's like you have that

[00:34:34] there you know so the podcast you're talking about dealing with the past I mean it's it's still a pretty taboo thing that people don't like to talk about yeah it's hard yeah you know and um I was telling Dick I said I keep death all around me he's like what do you mean and I was like I have skeleton paintings I have skulls I have actual skulls I have taxidermy I have wet specimens I have

[00:35:00] dead flowers I have I have literal representations of death and he's just like whoa and I'm like I surround myself with death because I want to meet death as a friend I want to I want to do that I don't I don't have a death wish I don't want to die but I don't fear it no you know the if there's a pain I'm not looking forward to the pain before it but I don't fear the dying part because I feel

[00:35:29] like why don't even know how much pain it's gonna be like I don't you know like I don't know I don't I have no idea for it it's just like anything else but that's why God's amazing because when you when you just trust in God I don't know I you can just walk into that and you you you know that if you're still have breath if you still have life and you're still here there's still a reason

[00:35:55] right you know like and so I went and I don't know I just I I I would imagine I'm gonna know when the time is to let go too and that there's I think so and that time isn't chosen for us no I would hope he lets us know I think that's why now this is why he invented airplanes because he was just like he's like well there's more people now we have to do this efficiently right it's it's it's these 75 people's

[00:36:24] time get them in the get them in the air well that will do that oh man yeah that's been real lately man that's why God invented a lot of things hurricanes a lot of the stuff that we've had to experience fires and then you get the plane in Canada that crashed flipped over the wings came off and everyone lived I know and and that was that was when he's like see they don't did it isn't always

[00:36:50] not always that's just him saying watch I can save some too I'm gonna shake the shit out of you yeah I hope y'all learned something because you know have you ever seen the skit with I what's his name is it Shane O'Neill he's on a plane with a bunch of people and they all think they're going down and they're all like they're like go call your loved ones they're all calling their loved ones

[00:37:15] and Shane O'Neill is on the phone and he's cussing someone else out and telling them how much of an asshole they are and like what he really thinks stops and they look at him he's like what are we doing this is the moment man get whoever is on the phone that you wanted to tell off get them we're dying say it oh that's there is something pretty about that isn't it

[00:37:44] that's what I think about like and there's a moment where they think that they're gonna survive and they're like oh my god what did I just well and they're like no we're really dying is that is that the one so do you call the person first that I love you and I'm just and then just make a fake crash noise and then hang up and then call all the people that you want to be an asshole to because you know you get another 10 minutes I'd be tempted to do that because I don't want to be on the phone with someone that loves me when I

[00:38:12] die so I'll just just fake die and then call somebody else I always think about my friend Evan this doesn't involve death this involves him moving away um and him being able to analyze his clientele he's like if you ever want people to finish their tattoos just tell them you're moving to another state and tell them they have a determined amount of time yeah it's good point they will get it done

[00:38:42] yeah yeah that's true that's the same it's the same with painters it's the same way I'm like um you want this to do I'm moving in two months oh oh okay let's do it now yeah exactly so yeah I I I think that's more of like the thing is that like you know if you survive a plane crash where you completely flip over and it rips off all the rings it's kind of like a okay dude

[00:39:11] you gotta you gotta get out of jail free card man you better make this one count yeah like yeah don't you don't need to play the lottery or go out you know don't have to worry what struck by lightning you've survived a plane crash that's right those other two things aren't happening so you might as well make something of yourself that's like a come to jesus if I ever heard one yes there are those moments it'd be cool to have an like a whole podcast of an interview of

[00:39:38] each one of those people oh isn't it right the one lady is suing the airline not her yeah she's the one I'd want to talk to we'd have fun with that it'd be like the person you call that you want to tell off but she's suing the airline for you know obviously oh I got beat up and you know in the in the crash and and and got airline yo have uh kerosene jet fuel all over

[00:40:05] me oh yeah it burned and I'm like you're not dead yeah you're gonna sue for that I'm not a suing person so I'd be like I mean I guess like I guess if I mean I don't know I don't I'm not it would have I would have to be in order for me to sue for any kind of damages I think I'd have I'd have to

[00:40:34] have my life permanently affected yeah you know I mean like and even if but the rest of my life I would still want some sort of negligence to be there because it's still flying yeah it's dangerous and things happen and and yeah if the pilot was was was drunk and everyone knew it when they took off yeah then I'm I'm taking your house and your family's gonna live in the street but yeah yeah

[00:41:00] but if it was just a freak accident they got they said they give everyone they're like here's thirty thousand dollars well then there you go you know money and run you get some there you go you know your skin's gonna itch for two weeks you'll be fine yeah no I'm with you I'm with you I'd have to know some kind of negligence I'd have to really be clear on that but even still I'm just kind of I'm I'm I'm more of a like thank god I lived yeah like oh my god like I'm so happy that I can just

[00:41:29] in my family yeah and I've been sued I wouldn't do that to anybody unless they really did something to me you've been like yeah I don't think so I I think I would just let that go I'm I'm I'm I haven't been sued before it does sound pretty awful yeah it's not good knock on wood it's not good that's a whole nother that's a whole nother conversation it is I did I you know I I do

[00:41:58] approach well sticking with our conversation I do approach it in a very god-centered kind of way um because I'm listening I'm just my I gotta itch in my throat I gotta get a cocktail here yeah yeah I can hear you so I'll just be watching from over there yeah yeah um so

[00:42:21] I try to uh do enough paperwork and enough consultation and enough back and forth and I really slow my business down enough so that there is evidence of accountability by my my clients so um typically like I've never run into a situation like I've definitely had mistakes

[00:42:49] but there's always been a working to resolution and restitution afterwards and I've only had to give money back well I'll give money back if I haven't done any work yet for sure like if if you know like if I haven't drawn anything I haven't done any work I'll give you your money back um just anybody's listening to this like if I haven't done it yet I'll probably give your money back that's fine um

[00:43:18] but if we're in my my bubble of where I hold you accountable to that money then you're gonna have to pay me a little bit and if I've drawn for you definitely but um I've only had to give money back once for a client who is displeased and the thing that I tried to do with that was have a lot

[00:43:39] of digital paper trail to show that I gave every possible option yep to make it better to this client and she just didn't want to come back to me and she you know at part of it was she felt embarrassed because she was pretty hyper as a person and um I think she kind of felt I don't know I she might

[00:44:08] she might have just not liked me I don't know I don't know what what exactly what it was but she wouldn't even let me see the tattoo like healed in person and and I was like I can't first of all I can't do anything for you until it's healed and I can't you know we have to assess this from where it is now right I'm fine going back yeah like I can't I can't go back I could if if she was willing to do

[00:44:34] it I could pay to have some laser tattoo removal for her like that's an option um which I would I like if it got there I would you know that's what I would do so you're done yeah I would I would rather that be and then be sued you know like that's horrible like I'll do what I can you know there's going to be a pain involved there's going to be suffering involved she could still sue me after that I'm sure all right question for you did you were there red flags going into that in the in the

[00:45:04] initial process and coming I've got a story because yes um you can tell sometimes that the person's going to be a problem they were less typically now I have those red flags and they're glaring enough that I say I'm not the one and we don't even engage right but this particular client um do you get that point of like there's some red flags here but I think that we can get through them I

[00:45:31] think that the work will stand on its own and the work probably did stand on its own but it wasn't what they thought it was going to be well I've got I've got what you're thinking about that I've got a story what I used to paint motorcycles which is very similar to tattooing where people think it's permanent and it's many thousands of dollars to paint a motorcycle yes and there was a guy that came in

[00:45:57] and this was I don't know probably 15 years ago and I painted as well it was I just had a feeling about this one and I should have just turned it down and I started working on it same thing paper trail here's the drawing here's the color of your bike it's this color I'm going to put this piece of art on there it's going to look like this and I did it in the computer so you could like this signed off and everything everything was good painted the thing stuff like that he had a friend

[00:46:24] that was with him a couple of the times who was kind of kind of a jerk but I didn't care I'm not paying for him right apparently I was so the guy comes and picks up the bike loves it goes home with his buddy comes back like two days later I really don't like this paid me and I'm like well we've

[00:46:49] we've gone through this with this whole thing it looks exactly look here's the picture here I mean it's like perfect I just don't like it I'd like my money back all right I didn't even think about it I said okay I'll give you your money back give me the tanks he's like what I'm like well you're not keeping the art no so yeah he's like he's like uh well what do you do I'm like I'll give you your money back come back tomorrow so he's like okay he came back tomorrow and his tanks were sanded down

[00:47:19] to bare metal and his fenders were sanded down to bare metal and I gave him back you can't do that with a tattoo obviously but it was one of those things I'm like you're not this is what you get now you here's all your money back and here's your here's your stuff nothing's ruined I mean he could have probably sued me if he wanted to right but I had the paper trail too so it's like you didn't

[00:47:43] neither of us have any money so there's no point suing me right well and with her it I can admit some fault on my own because she was older and her skin got really inflamed very quickly and so it was hard the issue was she contacted me the day after not even the day after it wasn't even a full

[00:48:08] day and she had removed the bandage that was supposed to stay on two days like immediately oh and it's basically a sticker that she ripped off of already pissed off skin and she's like she sent me pictures of it like that were this zoomed in on yeah so it anything like anything that anything

[00:48:33] that you look up that close it's going to look awful right and it was it was already pissed off and so I was like look I understand that you don't like what you're seeing right now right there's literally nothing I can do yeah like we're here I need you to heal let's get to the heel I did prepare her that

[00:48:59] we might have to go back into it because her skin was getting very inflamed while it was happening and I was not able to see as much and I'd already told her I said you know I I do like I do like to have more than one session because I'd like to see it healed and I'd like to make adjustments anyway um but she just would not let this thing heal wouldn't show me any picture of it from like

[00:49:24] a distance that like showed it and and then wouldn't come in afterwards for me to see it healed to even assess it and she said that she wanted to go to this other artist and she said well I'm gonna have to wait for a very long time for him but I guess I'll just suck it up if you can just give me half the money back so I can pay him to do it I'll be content and I was like cool yeah here you go cool

[00:49:52] sweet if that if that'll if that'll make you not have to come back here ever again that's worth it I mean no I won't she wouldn't because I I mean she was already committed to never coming back right um and I was just like I don't I think the red flags was that she was so particular and so like she had things to critique even about the guy that she was going to go see

[00:50:20] to fix my work like she already had his work and was even critiquing his work and I was like okay and so I was taking deep details from her critique of his work and the other work that she had gotten right make sure you don't do that and trying to do it and then yet again pissed her off you can't you just can't please some people in and that was really the red flag was just that that from what I could

[00:50:49] tell of her personality once I had spent like a few hours with her I was like this is a woman who cannot be pleased she was single uh had couldn't couldn't be in a relationship was very picky like she was showing me you know her match matches on you know her dating sites and she was very critical of the men and I was just like you are gonna be alone yeah yeah and I was like what is cute

[00:51:18] he's looking cute like she's like I don't know what do you what about that hat and I'm like I like hats you know like look he can he can rock a couple different looks right there that's that's versatility well a lot of people are happy in their misery because they know it I don't think she was though she confessed to really not being and she really liked me I could tell that she liked me but I think

[00:51:43] that I freaked her out and I think the whole thing freaked her out I honestly can it's just one of those people who should have just never gotten tattooed ever should have never even started yeah just and like you said there are people who think a certain thing about what's happening and that's not at all what it is and you know they they don't understand what they're getting into and and you

[00:52:11] know like you said like a a paint job on a on a vehicle is not going to last forever you're going to have to redo it eventually it's going to get you know dented up and dirted up and you're talking you're talking about me like so that's why I don't have tattoos because I don't I don't trust an artist to put on my body what my thoughts are now if I had you do a tattoo it would I wouldn't approach it

[00:52:38] like that it would be this is what I want but I want your rendition of it yeah because it would be a piece of art from you to me that's that's what I would want and that's the relationship that I would want with my tattoo artist right because it I have to want what their work is on me not what I want on there if that makes sense it's and that was the other thing um she wanted the poor the poor man's

[00:53:07] blah blah blah because she didn't want to wait for the other guy yeah so I was doing my version of his work yeah and I was like okay well I don't do this all the time so you know I think I can I think you do it decent enough and I'm listening to you as best I can but yeah I mean there's

[00:53:34] for me art is messy and and when you totally and when you deal with people it's even messier you know because more people more problems so when you bring another person into your art space and you're working on them and with them it it gets messy and I think you got to be along for the ride I think you got to really enjoy that kind of trip honestly I guess I'm not

[00:54:01] tattooed but like some of the work that I've seen you do there was one that you did and it was all up with some lady's leg it was like a mermaid that wrapped kind of up and around and it was I looked at that I'm like I would have that whole thing on my leg like like I don't want like I don't have any tattoos but I'd be like I want something like that not that exact thing but like yeah can you just do something like that and go crazy having never had a tattoo how stupid is that right I mean like

[00:54:28] here do my whole leg do it yeah that's great my my alpha also thought is I'm gonna wait till I'm a little older to get tattoos before my skin gets too crunchy because it's still pretty nice yeah you got nice skin and um before it gets too crunchy because then when I am old the tattoos will look sweet and you know you want to be badass when you're on your deathbed like my my dad said I'll tell you one more quick dad story this was hilarious we're sitting at the table I mean he got poor guy

[00:54:57] can't eat anymore it's he was a mess and he's sitting there and he looks over at me he goes you know when I go I told the coroner to put a bunch of Orville Redbacher in my chest before they put me in the in the ovens there so when they cremate me it's gonna be epic he says I'm like there's a guy that's not afraid no there's an unafraid human being right there and

[00:55:27] it taught me a lot he says that he's even joking about it and of course like my poor family they were horrified I was me and Stacy we're like we're like that's like my aunt Mary as my dad's aunt she one of the last things she said before you know she they eventually there's there's no response or anything but one of the last things she said she

[00:55:50] was like what are all of you so upset about I got news for you ain't none of us getting out of here alive yeah that's great well it's you know that at the at the no fucks left to give part of life I mean it was that was that the conversation we had right before I left was for half an hour

[00:56:17] it was the most open yeah free-flowing conversation that's why I want my wits that's the one thing I've asked God for I'm like please just let me have my wits I would love to have my full brain you know when I'm when I'm because I find so much funny and I me too I think it would be I just I really want

[00:56:44] to be cognizant of it right like I want to I want to feel it like I really want to feel it and process I want to process the people around me all of it like I just want I want to take in their faces I want to do it all like I just sort of I want to observe that at my dad's funeral you know it's funny my brother and me yeah they had the thing there that we had a little reception pretty small little side room off to the

[00:57:13] side in the funeral home you know with there was like lemonade punch and cookies and the standard fair people talking and stuff my brother goes hey uh help me tell me in mom's car I gotta get something I'm like all right so we go to her car which is a volkswagen beetle convertible turbo 93 year old woman drives that love her he opens the trunk up and he goes you want a little bump we both got our

[00:57:37] drinks and he brought a bottle of vodka so we go back in we went out we went back out once or twice oh that's awesome just a little something to take the edge off yeah and it was funny because my sisters are like what Kenny and David seem to be taking this pretty well yeah man and we're like you know it but it was great it was just one of those moments of just absolutely brotherly awesomeness of

[00:58:06] just my brother looked at me he's my older brother looked at me and knew exactly what I was thinking it would be nice if someone had a little bit of just I could use a little bump right now because this is rough yeah yeah and uh you know we did it it was good it was uh really something else well and you know uh I think that that's uh you know art art is a connection tool and um because

[00:58:35] communication and everything like that and um you know one thing that I hear a lot about uh especially that just makes me upset now um is when I hear that people are disconnected from their families you know like like like the whole like I won't sue thing there's I there is gonna have there would

[00:58:59] have to be like exceeding amount of abuse for me to not you know like to disconnect from my family you know like you shared a little bit about the trials and and we I there are definitely parts of my family that we have disconnected from for sure but like immediate family like your mom your dad your your brother your sister like that kind of stuff that stuff's you gotta you gotta be very careful with

[00:59:27] those things and I I that's a that's a a tough thing when you have to completely several sever ties and when you hear that that's something that's happened yeah I'm sure you can die you know have death with that and be completely fine with the outcome but um it's hot it's it's it's hard you know I have I have one brother that I didn't disconnect to him from but he's kind of disconnected from me and

[00:59:53] I'm I still don't really know why yeah and it's kind of strange thing but this there's five of us kids so four out of five ain't bad no but you know Stacy's family is pretty disconnected and um and dysfunctional my mom's too very disconnected and by proxy I'm disconnected from those people too but most of my field we're still pretty tight you know we're spread we're disconnected by distance I've got I live here

[01:00:22] in Wisconsin and I've got a brother and a sister in Massachusetts a brother in Florida a sister in Alaska that also goes to Arizona help my mom and my mom's in Arizona so we're spread out all over and it's been that way for decades right so you know there's times where I'll go two years without seeing assembling yeah during COVID I went for two and a half years or two years without seeing my parents because they bought into the COVID news bullshit that everyone's going to die if you talk to

[01:00:51] your family yeah and I wanted I'm glad that you brought that up um because you had sent me which by the way the the video production of that um baptism you know you're drawing at you know nice job on that it was really well done um would you mind if I shared that uh yeah I don't I don't I don't see that as a problem just give I would just share it I would just share the YouTube video and send people there so they can like it and stuff like that

[01:01:19] like yeah if you want to do it because it's right now I've got a hidden private um because Constance did it that their church did I mean I they wouldn't care if we shared it I'm sure it's on their website too but if you want to share that link to anybody you go right ahead that's it would bring um it would bring people to the church and it's a really cool thing and it's you know they have the sermon their sermon notes and you're uh you were major I mean you stood up and did a sermon

[01:01:48] at one point besides the fact that it's your story yeah so you know it was it was it seemed so foreign to me to actually tell that story because like I wasn't raised in the church or around very many religious people I didn't know really I mean it was and it was amazing me when I started I'm like then then all of a sudden I started finding all these it's like when you buy a different car all of a sudden you see all that same make car everywhere oh so all these good Christians

[01:02:18] start popping out of the woodwork I'm like yeah there's one hey this is really you too huh who knew you know it was uh it was really something else so that that was really special that was 2019 that was Easter so I was gonna ask about COVID because that happened right before yeah shortly after that you know obviously that was a year later but yeah um the church did whatever

[01:02:44] the all the other churches did in Minnesota and they shut down and I'm like but the last at that point nine years I've been going to this place to me all that went out the window I'm like I can't come here anymore well we can do an online thing we can I'm like I I can do an online thing anytime right yeah I need I need this place and these people to be with

[01:03:09] the people wanted to and that's where the big church thing yeah was a problem a small little church they didn't have those kind of problems because they were just like well I'm gonna give you a story because it's interesting because it they're the acronym for their name is now the acronym of ours um because ours went from a bigger church to a small church because my pastor would not

[01:03:39] do what they asked him to do during COVID and a parishioner offered up his private property for us to do church out of which is in a barn yeah yeah and and he got defrocked our our of 30 years in the um uh evangelical free church and we it was terrible what was happening during that time it was

[01:04:08] terrible and it was a witch hunt it was completely asinine he fought it for a very long time he even drove all the way to um forget the state he drove all the way there to be in front of the elders and he he he stood trial after trial like like please tell me what I'm saying that's unbiblical at the very least let me uh let me confront my accuser because you're telling me that I have an

[01:04:35] accuser nope it was it was heinous what they were doing and um he got defrocked and we all were like why why do you why do you have to be able to belong to the evangelical church and he and he was like he was like well you know I I wanna I want to work the steps of this because for me it's very biblical that I try to find reconciliation and that we try to figure this out that makes sense yeah and

[01:05:01] and he's like and it's important for me that that the story is that and and um so eventually we just became cornerstone free church and that's what we are now and it's little and it's it's amazing it's absolutely amazing I couldn't imagine having a church life any other way it it reminded me so this is what I thought and I hadn't soon after that I moved so I moved out of the state because the whole

[01:05:27] state had gone crazy like that so it's it wasn't like I was furious at the church and the people and stuff like that I was just disappointed yeah and I'm like disappointed enough that that I don't need to be part of that yeah um and I had given a lot to it not just my faith and and and love and at that point you had God yeah and I'm like I said obviously obviously on your own everything you've been talking about here it's like I guess not that important because you're saying it you know but

[01:05:55] rises above everything and and uh and the thing is is this church also we were in a very conservative town and we actually we were the number one most conservative town in the whole state they wouldn't have had a problem the sheriff I talked to the sheriff the sheriff wouldn't have shut us down it was just it was it was a business decision and that's where the big church thing that's where they lose their that's where they lose it and if had they it was a bad business decision

[01:06:24] because had they stayed open all of the other churches their people would have either stayed open or come to our church right and it we really could have stood up for something and they had the backing of the politicians in the area they had the backing of everybody and still just was like maybe we shouldn't and um well if they were a 511c3 they probably couldn't well yeah they absolutely could they just didn't want to because there was consequences that they couldn't face well the I mean maybe but

[01:06:55] Minnesota you gotta understand Minnesota was like one of the top five states of shutdowns no I know they were they were really really hard for me it wasn't the it wasn't the 501c3 thing wasn't a uh I'm sure it was a consideration but it wasn't they were more worried about everyone going to jail the people coming to the church the pastors the church the church elders these are all people

[01:07:24] that would be put in jail and this is what walls was doing the guy is absolutely he was he's insane evil during this yes yeah and he it was but again that's a test of a church your church did it right the guy we did a lot of our parishioners we actually um he gave up a lot and we have an interview um I

[01:07:46] actually met cal's cal's astro um a man that got put in federal prison for um uh violation of the face act because he had the audacity to pray outside of a church or outside of an abortion clinic and try to ask people not to kill their babies um and heather idoni right about that guy um we met her right before she was sentenced I think it was like 11 years that she was supposed to serve

[01:08:16] but she got out early because of trump he released all of them yeah he just let them all go yeah but like cal recently you know talked about his life in prison and how he was able to minister in prison and give god to you know at least one person and he's an incredible human and you know like you said that that is what you're teaching somebody I mean you know Paul wrote from prison yeah you know like

[01:08:46] well this was and this was the thing that that I'm like all right well you have to walk into your cross you have to walk it reminded me when that started happening all I could think of was when Jesus went and started in front of the church and was kicking all over the tables and they made it into a and I'm like this is what you guys this is what you guys are doing yeah you know if he was here right now he'd kick the doors open and invite everyone in and you guys don't want them you can go yeah

[01:09:15] you're not you're not needed here yeah you know and or we'll do it out in the parking lot or we'll do whatever we got to do to stand up to this pastor was like look you know if you want to wear a mask wear a mask if you don't have to wear a mask he was like I'm not scared you know my duty is to my flock my only my one thing is to give god's word perpetually to my my flock my obligation is that

[01:09:41] was there a time when that word was more valuable i know right in our lifetimes is there a time that that like people needed to hear that it's just like no you have strength in this yes there there is something going on here that's bigger than bigger than some cold that everyone's getting yeah it isn't wiping out nations something else is going on here this is the time for christians to

[01:10:04] stand strong yeah and you'll see him standing strong now now that the danger's gone now they're all yes yeah now when it's easy you know we didn't get to go to church for those years and now we can and we're going to stand strong it's like you didn't get to go to church because none of you stood up if you all showed up outside the doors if you all stood up outside the doors of the church you'd have

[01:10:29] gone to church and if the minister didn't come out and minister yep yeah you should you would have known something about him too yeah at minimum at minimum it was summer stand six feet apart it's not get some sunlight absorb some vitamin d in this church like i said it was a big church it was

[01:10:51] probably on 30 acres you know oh wow lots of land easily it was and it was also an old church it was originally built in like 1897 so it had been there all that time and never closed for anything ever except for that and i'm like the pastor had been there 25 years randy dishler and he was fantastic absolutely phenomenal pastor and no one stood up no one's no one was strong enough in their

[01:11:20] conviction to stand up and say nope we if if nobody comes that's okay but we're open right and in minnesota was hard we had um with with i do the podcast weathered report with uh bruce and bruce mcgee and jason and we had uh lisa how's that going oh it's fantastic we just had our one year anniversary

[01:11:44] oh yay episode 50 episode 53 dropped today i think oh that's awesome but um i was i saying the we had lisa monay on and she lisa she had a bar and she did all the compliance they shut down for a few weeks then it came then they were all to open again in minnesota did the club she had two restaurants and

[01:12:11] the restaurant bars and she they were doing better than a million a year i mean they were successful really good yes and uh she ran it very very well they shut her down and they said um okay you can't open unless you do this you know you got to put up the barriers and no one can sit at the bar and you can only have half the you know 50 you know basically you you're not even going to be in business but right you'll at least be able to stay in business a little bit right and then they

[01:12:37] said okay now you've done all that you get to be october and they're like you need to shut down and you have to and she's just like no i'm i've done everything you've asked i've complied with every ridiculous thing that you've asked us to i'm not complying and um long story short they came after her they took her liquor license for five years which basically shuts you down they fined her

[01:12:58] three hundred thousand dollars personally and um um so she had to declare bankruptcy of course because she doesn't have that money and she did that right you had to do it right away because it's like i'm not going to go deep into debt for this i gotta declare right now and then as as things it was all bs as things went away and in she was just they dropped the case but it was already too late

[01:13:27] her her two million dollar restaurants were closed and uh they said well okay now you can we'll let you have a liquor license again in a year and she's like wisconsin is literally 12 miles that way yeah and she crossed the border and opened in it called in to call it the outpost and and on the roof in 10 foot wide letters aimed toward where the airplanes take off so it's in

[01:13:55] the flight plan it says it said uh let's say um something not so good walls i love it wall sucks i think guys would say wall sucks and huge letters on the roof of it in the in the restaurants it's a restaurant bar and it's been a huge success and now she's moved to wisconsin as well so this is what's

[01:14:19] happening you know i have to catch this uh time with her sounds powerful she oh she she's great she rides a motorcycle and she's uh she's pretty cool but it's just one of the stories that happened in the in this in the state of there was a huge it's downplayed but this is why i have compassion for the people losing their federal jobs right really not i understand what they're feeling

[01:14:47] i felt it i was wrongfully terminated too right i was i was kicked to the curb after 11 years of dedication dedication and had to figure it out only i wasn't offered a buyout a month earlier right so i'm sorry i really find it hard to to muster up more than just a hey yeah boo what do you

[01:15:14] want like it's a job get get busy living get busy dying you're like me you know always have a side gig always have something a plan b always because you don't know what's going to happen my friend my friend cory we just had him on the show too because he talked about we talked about this entrepreneurship and stuff he worked at 3m as a corporate is 3m's corporate identity manager so corporate identity

[01:15:41] branding that kind of stuff he's a manager at 3m cool it's a big deal wow that's awesome 28 years he was there 6 000 people got laid off his whole department was shown the door and they like we can outsource all that stuff so he was like uh you know he's five years from full retirement and stuff that hurts

[01:16:01] yeah 28 years yeah so he had to at 55 or 56 years old 55 figure out what do i do now i've been working at the same place since i got out of college right now what so but he he he he sat and felt sorry for himself for a couple days as you're entitled to do and then he got to work and he developed his own

[01:16:26] company his own company as a as a c-suite branding in in in marketing um consultant basically dude that's awesome it's probably way better it's working out yeah and now he's like this is so much better this is right so much better yeah yeah no and that's what i'm saying like i know it's gonna be better for them if they just leave i know it's gonna be better for them if they leave um because like you've said

[01:16:51] this entire time embrace your cross walk towards your cross the struggles make you better it's gonna make you better and it's it's gonna give you a passion that you never had a heat to your life that you never had i remember speaking of joe rogan uh chuck palanchick um i think that's how you say palanchick or the guy who wrote choke and fight club and everything oh sure he had a financial advisor

[01:17:16] steal from him like a lot of money and it pretty much put him in the poor house and he knew who did it so he went after him but like you know it's all gummed up legally until he gets his money back and it was he was broke and joe was like dude how do you not want to hurt that person like how how are you seem pretty like chill and and he was like you know i'm not really

[01:17:43] mad he's like because you know when you have all that money there's just nothing to talk about yeah you know like you're you're too comfortable to make anything that has depth and he's like you know when that happened to me i had to write again and i wrote and it was kind of beautiful and that's the beautiful thing with being an artist too is that like the the pressure that heat of

[01:18:11] of trauma and passion and if you know how to work if you know how to take that energy and make it into something if you know how to create with with that energy it it always affords you something it's amazing you can channel it absolutely yeah one um what else was i gonna say um i i i left my brain um so probably it was probably already said with when what i was saying but

[01:18:41] yeah i um i i just uh oh i know what i was gonna say i didn't have a side gig i just don't think people understand how low i'm willing to go like prison doesn't even sound that bad to me i know it's bad but like okay if i have to go to prison for my convictions my belief okay what are my beliefs

[01:19:06] if not worth going to prison for exactly if not dying for right what are your beliefs about people were like oh you know these are just your beliefs like and i'm like just my beliefs how can you even say that flippantly like i don't want to know what the measure of your beliefs are

[01:19:29] because clearly they're tested dude uh yeah my people in my life know when you try to test me man i will i'll show you like a certain amount of finding out i'll burn this shit down like you don't even understand like i'll scrap it all and i've done it once i'll do it again and don't try me i will so

[01:19:55] like for me it was just kind of like oh i've been uncomfortable i'll be uncomfortable again that's fine yeah when you know how to be uncomfortable you don't want to be no but you know how to yeah you know it's gonna suck but whatever i i work i i know how to work on cars yeah some and i buy old cars that not like super old but i just i drive old beaters because i don't want a car payment

[01:20:20] yeah sometimes they bite you in the ass yeah and you know i bought stacy a subaru forester this year and it bit me in the ass it it was it bit hard hard like it was one of those moments where i'm like oh subaro's what i can either i can either just lose this money or fix it and fixing it means taking the

[01:20:44] engine out and taking the engine apart and redoing it so i took the engine out and took it apart and redid it and put it back in and it cost a bunch of money time and it took me a month to to finally because i'm you know still working and then it was inktober so i had to do those too so i'm getting the engine out this year you're a better man than me i nailed it this year well it's good but i also

[01:21:11] had this coloring book thing that i like to do yeah i did the one last year and this year really i'm like all right next year is going to be even better i'm looking forward to it i'm doing a little different that's awesome but that's the other thing is so there's always something to dream about you know like well i started looking into the coloring book world and i'm like wow this is a huge market that i didn't even know existed and there's a lady i don't remember her name she does like the simplest coloring books and i don't want to do just simple i want to do i want to do coloring books that i

[01:21:40] want to do and if no one buys them so be it i'll just have a stack of them but um she makes somewhere in the neighborhood of 260 to 280 000 a month selling coloring books on amazon i'm like brilliant i don't want to sell on amazon because i don't like amazon um i'm not necessarily against it but for right now i'm just gonna try and sell you know i made 50 of them i think i've got 40 left so we're on our way

[01:22:10] i love it i love it yeah i don't care i mean no at some point i look at this way at some point everyone that has an interest in art will know who i am and what i do right i'll have i'll have had that thing and then someone's gonna have one of my old coloring books there's gonna be a few of them left people go well wait you got one of those i heard he made those are you kidding me you know

[01:22:39] my mic is being ah all this time see it lasted this long there you go well maybe that's a sign it is getting late isn't it it is getting late i just wanted to say one more thing like you know god forbid because i don't want this to happen anytime soon i got plans with you man um but i always think about when i'm dead

[01:23:01] when i'm dead i want you know so you never sell any of them or from here on out think about what those coloring books are going to mean to somebody after you're dead when they find them and they're going to be able to sit with you and color yeah something that you let them put their mark on so exactly like my dad's music yeah it's amazing amazing so that's forever cool ken do you have um

[01:23:30] final words or something like that that you want to leave people with i mean we'll do this again i'm sure but oh yeah if we can think of something to talk about the you know final words i guess be good to people you never know where you're going to find friends that are lifelong friends um

[01:23:54] i i believe we are and even though we've only literally met in person one time i know it was so special though it really was it was cool and it was in this room yes but it's all over your house and your daughter's house like yeah that's true too well you tattooed her so she's gonna you have left her the the mark of the beast on her right and she drove me through a snowstorm that i was like

[01:24:17] what the hell anyway that's right i forgot about that but thanks for having me on amy yo it as we talked about doing this a week or two ago or it's just like let's just have a conversation and and amy's like i'll just record it i'm like that sounds good yeah we can do that i mean it can be catch up i'm sure i'll i'll cut up a few things like you know we'll see what what needs to be in there what not needs to be in there but i definitely want some clips of um your artwork and

[01:24:47] stuff thank you so much for that that was such an inspiration i think that's gonna glad you liked it and i'm glad that as much as that church was kind of a disappointment in some way they they're not actually in in their production and and what they were able to bring uh i'm sure you got a lot of tips from just their production quality too oh absolutely in fact the guy that was the producer

[01:25:12] for that video hired me to do a portrait a little five by seven portrait of his cat for his wife this year that's so great so i got to talk to him again yeah i'm i have no animosity towards the church no no no i said i had it it's a disappointment but it's not a it's not a hatred or or i would still i would still pretty much take a bullet for anybody there yeah they're wonderful people yeah

[01:25:42] so i but it is a it's a it's a very defendable moment yeah and when you see something like that so i understand it but like they they've given this podcast and you know your process coming to god a very interesting story and no i cherish it love it i love it cherish it it's wonderful i really

[01:26:06] appreciate you thank you for sharing all that because it's intimate it's it's tricky to share because i'm not a person that would usually have talked about the good news of jesus christ you know but i i i like it and if you want i can send you the i can i'll put it on we transfer something send you the folder of all those drawings so you can you can look through them and if you have questions

[01:26:34] i want to do something with them so if you have any ideas there's got to be something i could do and i know the church would back us too yeah so um if there's something that we we could do together um maybe shed some light on the church in a good light yeah yeah i mean they were the inspiration well they were they were the thing that i just love that they allow for notes to go on for their sermon and it kind

[01:27:01] of left that open and um you know i i don't i don't know what could happen of it either but like i think you have a coloring book right there just based off of what the sermon was i know they did something in the church but they're your drawing so oh exactly there's no reason why you can't it it's something that i will do and use yeah i just haven't figured out what yet yeah you know the idea

[01:27:30] of doing a book could be cool and i've kicked that around to do a coloring book now would be now that i've done a couple of them that would be a lot easier than i i started three or four times to actually write a book right about them i was just overwhelmed yeah yeah i'll just tell ai to write the book and i'll just put the drawings in beautiful well and it could just be it could just be the

[01:27:55] picture and then you know like a phrase of the bible that inspired it and then maybe a little spot for somebody to write something or draw their own thing and have a blank sheet in between each you know like the idea was a little devotional yeah you know i was going to do a it was going to be a 52 page devotional yeah so and and i have enough drawings to do three of those so be three years

[01:28:19] of devotionals wow which is pretty it's pretty cool you could do a deck of prayer cards prayer cards would be cool yeah that'd be cool i hadn't thought about that that'd be good that'd be really cool you know the the the backstory and the origin story of them is i'm just i'm looking over here because that's where i got it up on the screen is and now you could actually bring back to the church you go to

[01:28:45] the church and be like would you like to do a brand of uh using my drawings prayer cards for the church right that'd be kind of cool yeah i don't know i don't know but i think that'd be neat that would be cool to do for sure i like the prayer card idea i think that's my favorite idea yet hell yeah i got nothing but ideas yeah i don't mean to that's my problem

[01:29:12] well maybe we can just give them now we'll be hopefully teaching people we just give them to all people and we can see what they do with them because that's all i want to do plant seeds yep yeah see what happens some will work you never know what's gonna you never know what's gonna pop up nope no you know you get those people once a while that show up 10 years after you do something you're like oh i was at this thing and i saw you i'm like what yeah wow like you said be open to

[01:29:38] making friends anywhere never burn bridges all that good stuff yeah yeah it's the golden rule it really it really is the best way to live it is it is it's what jesus would do right and i all i add with it's like i live try to live like jesus just with shameless capitalism yes yes i'm also that guy

[01:30:00] well because it's fun it is it's freedom you know it's it's seeing it's seeing what you can make and manifest and play and you're teaching other people to play and what they can create and it's it's it's too cool it's so we all can rise together i think it's that part i forget where it is but it's it's the gifts that keep expanding yeah it's awesome exactly you do that and you know uh

[01:30:27] very wealthy people can be very generous generous generous generous with their with their incomes and their money and most of them are yes and that in in most of them do it quietly because they don't want to have a big deal made about it yeah um i cannot wait to be one of those people you already are you already are to do to do what you do with that urn that's a measure of wealth a little bit but i i

[01:30:55] want to i appreciate that thank you but you know it the measure of wealth is i want the life-changing kind of things of because i've helped people in the past stacy and i both helped people in the past and the family and whatnot people are in trouble and what we usually find is people that are in trouble are in trouble because they're in trouble and they don't want to get out of it and you're just you're just a bridge for a little while to get them over some burning boat that they jumped off of

[01:31:22] and they're just going to go and jump on another one but to be able to help people for real with some training and some some other stuff that i mean you you i get what you're saying you want it to be more acute but because i was in the service industry and i know the impact of what just a good haircut can do for somebody yeah i can change their entire day their entire perspective

[01:31:48] it can keep people from doing very drastic things that they were thinking about doing you never know what's going on in someone's head and that moment that you did it it meant the world to that whole family like yeah that's a life-changing thing that i'm pretty sure that when people really sit on it and think on it they're like that's the kind of person i would like to be right you know i hope so

[01:32:13] no i i know so because you don't want to be exactly like me though i got some twisted stuff going on you can't be exactly but i mean like the gesture like to to be able to be like nah man i you don't have you don't have to give me any money like that's right well yeah and he didn't yeah that's what i'm saying it's like but i didn't refuse i didn't refuse it either i could see it you know this there's times where you can see it in someone's eyes yeah they really want to give back they're

[01:32:41] like no this meant something and it would almost be it would be an insult not to yeah well it's like my thing when i tell people you know i don't tip you know like i don't really they're like i want to tip you and i was like well you know you can write me a google google review yeah and they'll usually do both say nice things about me online please yeah yeah like they usually do both and so it's like

[01:33:05] you know that's what it is to like be really wealthy in my opinion is that so i guess what i would say and and yes our final hours we've been doing this for a while midwest goodbye yeah midwest goodbye is if you have if you're a friend of amy's a lover of her work like i am um or mine or any other of

[01:33:29] your favorite artists when you see stuff going through on social media don't just like it the likes we all love the likes is great for us personally but does nothing for us you need to make some comments in there start a conversation yeah um share it with with with with comments if you like some picture just say my god look at this beautiful tattoo my friend amy did this is the this is one of the things that she could do go check out her stuff those mean the world to us that means more to us than

[01:33:58] anything from a from a art standpoint it means someone cares enough to take a couple of minutes of their day and just share what we have poured our lives into and algorithms don't don't help us at all they don't help us at all what helps us is people actually sharing this stuff and i say this for all artists um i'm not even gonna plug any of my stuff because i just this is just a general rule um share

[01:34:28] comment do those things because that really is what we need you see those the memes a lot you know the guy says how come you're not such a big person to use because you didn't share my shit it's true so do that for people you know like and share the show let me make sure you listen to the last at least five episodes of this show with amy because everyone is completely different boy

[01:34:56] they're a lot of fun to listen to i listen to them at work a lot because i got i got the time when i'm working on the computer you know oh it's just great to have him on and then other people get to hear him too i'm so honored um thank you ken that was perfect thank you thank you thank you thank you you're a blessing you are as well we'll see you sometime in the next couple years

[01:35:21] go go go okay listeners that wraps it with ken for this time i do hope i get to see him at some point in the flesh it's been way too long i um i have far too many friends this way please if you have any idea of anything that ken can do with these awesome um illustrations that

[01:35:46] he's done while he's experienced god's word please write in to the podcast our our email is there for you to write in you could also dm uh definitely reach out to ken directly uh mad case studio is his instagram it's m-a-d-d-k underscore studio that's his instagram just just reach out and you know give

[01:36:15] him some idea of what he might be able to do with it he he might run with it and you know if a fraction of the things that we dream of doing actually get done well then we will have lived a very productive life and i think have um very much so expanded on all the gifts that we were given

[01:36:37] i'd like to think anyway um i hope and time isn't isn't over yet at least not for me right now and you if you're listening to this so what i hope and pray is that we continue to get more time and that by the end of listening you have a very very powerful week god bless you listeners god

[01:37:03] bless you ken god bless us all thanks for listening you can find the apprenticeship diaries on twitter facebook and instagram our ig is the underscore apprenticeship underscore diaries if you would like to offer constructive criticism or an interview drop us an email at the apprenticeship diaries at gmail.com we look forward to hearing from our listeners